On our first episode of Let’s Talk Teaching, we explore effective strategies for creating positive and supportive classroom environments that foster connections, while improving learning outcomes for students.
Welcome to the first season of Let's Talk Teaching!
In this episode, we explore effective strategies for creating positive and supportive classroom environments that foster connections, while improving learning outcomes for students.
Our guests and experienced educators, Dr. Maria Gindidis, Schy Prewett, and Callum Mackay share their insights, personal experiences, and successful strategies in managing student behaviour, and establishing respectful and engaging learning environments.
Together, we explore:
Don’t miss this conversation packed with personal tips and techniques from our experienced educators on how they manage student behaviours and create supportive classroom environments. Join us today and Let’s Talk Teaching.
Special Guests:
Dr Maria Gindidis - Senior Lecturer and Course Leader, Bachelor of Education (Honours) Faculty of Education, Monash University.
Schy Prewett - Assistant Principal - Bentleigh Secondary College, Bentleigh East, Victoria. Check out her LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, and the school website.
Callum Mackay - Leading Teacher - Brentwood Secondary College, Glen Waverley, Victoria.
If you’re enjoying Let’s Talk Teaching, don’t forget to subscribe, rate and review! You can follow us on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook, and share your thoughts on the show by using the hashtag #letstalkteachingpodcast
If you’re interested in hearing more about the short courses, undergraduate, and postgraduate study options that Monash Education offers, please visit the Monash Education website.
Access this episode's transcript here: https://lets-talk-teaching.simplecast.com/episodes/building-better-behaviour-through-effective-classroom-management/transcript
This podcast is recorded on the land of the Boonirong people of the Eastern Kulin Nation.
We'd like to pay our respect to Elders past and present and acknowledge that this land was stolen and never ceded.
Welcome to Let's Talk Teaching, the podcast created by teachers, for teachers.
I'm Associate Professor Rebecca Cooper, Director of Initial Teacher Education at Monash University's Faculty of Education,
and I'll be your host for this series.
Our aim is to create a conversational series that's informative, engaging and relevant
to your teaching practice.
Joined by academics and teaching alumni from Monash University, we'll be exploring the
challenges, issues and experiences you might be facing in and out of the classroom, drawing
on their personal experiences to provide you with valuable insights into the world of teaching.
As teachers and educators, we all know the importance of creating a positive and supportive
classroom environment but figuring out how can be a daunting challenge.
Joining us today to share some of their effective strategies that encourage positive student
behaviour and help establish respectful and engaging learning environments are experienced
educators Dr Maria Genditas, senior lecturer, course leader and beloved education guru here
in Monash's Faculty of Education, Sky Pruitt, assistant principal at Bentley Secondary College
and Callum Mackay, leading teacher at Brentwood Secondary College.
Welcome everybody to this episode.
I am really excited to chat with each of you about your personal and your classroom experiences.
So, Maria, I'm going to start with you.
I knew you would.
Oh, you knew I would.
But what interests you about this topic?
What doesn't interest me about this topic?
It was a topic that was at the forefront of my mind when I started teaching many,
many, many moons ago, but in pre-service education, we've got 500, let's say, first years this
year. What is the question they all ask? How do you manage a classroom? What is the one
thing they fear? Managing behavior. And the media doesn't do much to assist what's happening
out there. And they seem to feel that it's going to be the biggest hurdle they have to
cover and deal with. So that really interests me in unpacking it, in looking at it in a more
positive way and in understanding that classroom management is the macro. Behavior management
is the micro and to get them to understand the differences. Sure, Skye, I can see you
nodding along there. Does this resonate with you? Yeah, absolutely. Look, I think if students
aren't in their best mindset, they're not going to be ready for learning. So if we don't
have the environment that is set up for them to be in their best behavior and have the
best classroom management, then we really aren't going to have an environment that's
conducive to learning.
And Skye, you're currently working in a school. So what what does that look like at your school?
Yeah, for us, we are looking at how emotional intelligence is playing into students' understanding
of themselves and also of others. So we've developed a survey and content with GenOS 360
and they basically are looking at their own emotional intelligences, how they react to
things and then looking at how their classmates might be emotionally reacting to things and
then giving them some tools about how to deal with those situations that might cause conflict
or also confusion in the classroom. And I think that's really important because lots
of our learning isn't individual learning, it's actually collaborative learning. So those
tools of knowing myself and knowing others that I'm working with are really going to
help with that collaborative environment.
So that's really putting the students at the centre of the management of themselves in
a way. That's a really sort of different approach. How's that been working with the students?
How have they responded to that?
I think they understand now a lot more about themselves and they are able to recognise
the emotions that they're having a lot easier. There are trends coming through now at that
primary school level where they do do things like self-regulation from a very early age.
So they're starting to have that language that they've already used in the primary school setting.
So when they're coming through at that year seven and year eight level, it is an alien to them to
talk about how they're emotionally ready for learning. They're also using techniques for a
mindfulness to help to get them into the right space and to regulate themselves.
And so we're just really pulling those tools that they are starting to use at the primary school level up into the high school.
And then taking it to the next level by looking at how that interaction is, you know, impacted by somebody else's emotional state also.
OK, Callum, does this resonate with any of your experiences working in you've worked across a few different sorts of schools?
Does this resonate with any of your experiences?
Yeah, so it's really important to identify the differences between a mainstream and a special
education setting because obviously it's the case for all schools. Certainly that each student
will be individual and will have individual needs, but particularly making sure that teachers have a
sustainable approach to managing student behaviors and student behavior needs, whilst also keeping
in mind particularly in a special setting that the way we respond to behavior for one student
obviously doesn't work for the wide range of the rest of students, which can then further exacerbate
problems. And that's why it's really important, like I said, to have sustainable
practices and sustainable and realistic ideas about what we can achieve with student behaviour,
particularly new educators come in with this idea that they're going to change the world and
You know, fantastically optimistic about everything, but not realistic.
And that's, I think, a real gap in area for growth in pre-service teachers and initial teacher education.
Yeah, I agree. The rose-coloured glasses. Yeah.
And like you said before, that media coverage about everything that's wrong with
teaching and schools is not really helping anything at the moment.
Yeah. Yeah.
We need to change that lens and...
And even the media coverage is specifically of behaviour in classrooms. I mean, how does that
make you feel when you see that? Or does it make you, you know, want to jump up and tell the general
public something about the realities of what you're dealing with? I mean, any of you can respond to
that. For us, it's not really the reality. Our school doesn't look like that on a daily basis.
And even if you were having kind of more extreme behaviours, I was just saying to a group of new
staff, really you have to go down to the core of why that behavior is happening.
And it always is a communication of some sort. The student is trying to tell you
something. It might be that you don't have enough routine in your classroom or
perhaps they don't feel like, you know, that the environment is set up in a way
that they can learn or maybe even there's an outside factor that's
contributing to why they're acting in this way. So I did say to them they really
need to drill down into what is the underlying cause for this behaviour.
Because students don't come to school just wanting to make our lives a misery.
They're actually there to want to learn and almost every student that we meet is coming
there wanting to do their best and to be appreciated and understood by adults that are working with
them.
In addition to that, I think it's really important to note that a lot of students see
school as their safe space.
Yes.
to actually learn but to to be in an environment where they feel they can be
themselves and they feel comfortable to sort of let their hair down a little bit.
And that's certainly something I've found at my previous school. A lot of the
students who you know we might consider to have behavioural issues are really
just there being at school to have that social interaction that they're missing
at home or to have any sort of interaction and feeling safe.
Callum, you're so right. I've worked in some of the most challenging schools. We had to get
part training, professional assault responsive training, because we had students that would
throw chairs around. And your duty of care was to the other students before you could do anything.
And I totally agree with that. I actually think that there is nuanced complexities around why,
but your classroom is a refuge. We're not, and that's what we tell our pre-service teachers.
You're, you know, you're rose-coloured glasses.
You're not a psychologist.
You are not a sociologist.
You're not going to save the world
by trying to understand one student.
You are a teacher.
And for that, you have to create a classroom
that is a refuge, a safe space.
And if they equate that with education,
then you might just be breaking the barrier of poverty
or SES or generational poverty,
where these children see learning as a positive place.
And so they'll push forward into maybe doing more years
than they would have or anyone in their family did,
which then gives them opportunities
as we know down the track.
But you're right.
In the first lecture we ever give,
I always stand there and say, right everybody,
there are three things you have to know about teaching.
And you can see the first years,
they get out their laptops, they're ready to write it down.
This is gold.
And all I say is relationships, relationships,
relationships, that is it.
You focus on making sure the child feels safe, the student feels safe and you're building
that rapport with them, the other stuff will come.
Once they feel comfortable in an environment, they might go, "Do you know what?
I'll give this a go.
I'll give this a try."
I think when they start to feel valued by us, when we know who they are, we want to know
their likes and dislikes, their interests, and then we can really get to know them as
people.
They do.
They feel valued.
For some of them, that might be the only kind of connection that they're getting of
that kind.
Do any of your schools do restorative justice?
We do have restorative practice techniques, yes.
So it's, as I've said already, about drilling down to the reason for the behaviour rather
than trying to say to the student, you know, what you did was wrong, pointed at them as
a person.
It's not them as a person.
It's about the thing that happened.
And also trying to then get the students, you know, in control of coming up with a solution.
So there's not much use there sitting in a meeting with a student going over what happened,
but it's actually about how we're going to move forward.
Do we need to have a restorative conversation amongst peers or with a teacher?
What's the plan?
But the plan must include the student because if it's a bunch of adults sitting around coming
up with an adult solution for a student level problem, we're probably not going to get that
long-term kind of effect we want.
my previous school, Special Education School, restorative didn't necessarily work in the
same way.
And so it was those sorts of conversations when we had an incident, we tried to move
on from it.
It was along the lines of how do we move forward with this.
And I was lucky, well I was dealing with some of the senior students, so in terms of their
ability to work with me on that, it was a good conversation but it was purely just how
do we move forward.
Let's not worry too much about the wider range of the event and what's happened, but let's
move forward.
What can you do to work with such and such and vice versa?
Let's focus on those next steps.
So then you've got these beautiful first year pre-service teachers or in your case perhaps
you've got colleagues who are graduates.
How do you help them to establish the relationships and the rapport?
What's the way in?
you start with what worked for them when they were at school because that's what
you want to unpack. It's not going to work now. It's a different generation. And
what worked for you meant that it worked for you because of the type of learner
you were, who you were. You've got 25 different students in a particular
classroom. They are so unique that you now have to drill down and understand you
are there for all of them. And what worked for you and your go-to in terms of
classroom management is what we want you to reflect on, look at evidence, think of new
skills, think of new ways. That's for the pre-service teachers.
Yeah, or the research tells us that the pre-service teachers do default to what they experienced
that was successful for them. So I think that's a really, really great starting point is to
know what that default's going to be.
Yes.
To start with, to articulate it, bring it out and name it so that they're aware of when
it is what they're returning to.
But what might it look like for graduate teachers?
So a lot of those relationship building moments
actually come through the routine.
It might be that you're having your students line up
outside the classroom,
and it's the incidental conversations you have
as you're walking in.
Hey, listen, I heard you had a game of footy
on the weekend, how'd you guys go?
Or it might be when you're moving around the classroom
to look at students' work,
you're actually making a point of having those conversations with the students.
But we do say to the new teachers, you know, make a record of those things.
We hope that within the first few weeks, you know, at least three things about the
student that's outside of the classroom.
So it might be the pets that they have or the footy team that they go for, or
maybe whatever hobby they have on the side.
So I think it's really important for us to actually make that a part of our
practice and make it very purposeful.
Yeah.
So routine, but not bland, sort of roll it out routine.
Within the routine structure that you have.
So you're not necessarily, you know, having a set series of
questions that you're asking, but more that you find those
pockets of non explicit teaching time that you are getting to
know the students a little bit more.
I suppose in the sense of routine that the students also
then know it's an opportunity to tell you something if there's something to tell you,
particularly if you know you were saying before about it being that safe space.
Yeah. Yeah.
So I just want to touch on what you're saying, the note taking.
It is so important and I could understand that a pre-service teacher might find that
a bit unusual and go, I'm just taking notes about or graduate teacher rather.
I'm taking notes about my classes and the little bits of information they say,
but it is so valuable.
And I've been very lucky at my new school, exceptionally lucky even that the
the teacher that I've taken over there, classes from,
has written me a list of notes about each of the students.
So I've gone in there already knowing little bits
of information about those students so I can touch on it
and show them that I'm here to get to know them.
And so we can work together on the class material,
but I also care about who you are.
And it's been fantastic.
And I'm a big advocate for knowing bits and bolts
and writing that down.
I saw a teacher recently use Siri.
Oh, huh.
And then puts anecdotal notes
because they don't have time.
And talking about, I just want to touch on you
what you said there, Sky, in the primary school,
visual timetable and routine and special schools,
having it up there with pictures in most cases.
So they know what's coming next, when is play,
because they don't have a sense of time.
It's only when you're eight years old, you even get a sense.
That's why they measure life by how many sleeps
till the birthday party.
So that structure, very important.
Absolutely.
So there's a sense of structure coming through here.
There's a sense of routine,
but I wonder is there also a need to be a little bit open
and flexible at the same time?
I mean, it's a bit of,
I think I get that I'm asking for a bit of balance
and a bit of magic here,
but I would have thought there'd be a notion of response
and reaction to what's happening in the room.
I think the routine is really
about how you run your classroom.
If the students understand that we line up in this fashion,
we sit down in this fashion,
we have learning intention, success criteria,
those are all the things that I see as non-negotiables.
They just make students feel safe
because the environment is set up in a way
that they understand what the expectations are
and they know how to meet those expectations.
You're not doing them a favor
if there's sort of that hidden curriculum of,
I don't know what to do and how to do the right thing.
So you need to take that away.
And that's the same for the primary and the special setting.
The students understand what's expected of them,
then they will try to meet that expectation.
Then there's the flexibility that happens.
You have to be flexible as a teacher.
I don't think, you know, there's any person
that's ever gone into teaching that hasn't had to change.
They're less in plan at a 10 of a dime.
But it's also about the different people.
You know, I might have two year eight drama classes,
but they're like chalk and cheese.
So the curriculum that I'm doing for one,
or the classroom management tool I'm using for one
is certainly not going to work for another.
But there's no harm in also maybe having a conversation
with my colleague who teaches the same class for maths
and finding out whether or not they're using a technique
that's working really well for them.
It might sound a little bit strange for a drama teacher,
but they might have the gold that I'm missing
because I'm doing something different in my classroom
and vice versa.
So that's kind of sharing with colleagues
is really important.
And I think particularly for graduate teachers, knowing that if it doesn't work in their class
and they're a bit stressed about that, it's okay to ask and knowing when to go to that
colleague and saying, "Hey, I'm doing this in my class.
It's not working."
I see that you've had a great relationship with Maria, for example.
How did you do it?
It's super important.
So when do you go and ask?
Well, it's going to be different for everybody.
I think it's certainly important to reach out before you get to that point where you feel
like you've failed in a class.
I'd say, you know, if you've had a class and you've tried something, okay, that's not working
and I've tried something else and it's still not working.
Ask, ask earlier rather than later.
It's better to get that relationship and to build those routines as early as possible.
So if you're waiting months and months, get the terms free and you know, you know what,
this class is still not working.
Let's try something else.
If they're year sevens, for example, they've got six months of structure already in high
school, they're not going to change that quickly.
It'll take another couple of terms.
So definitely sooner rather than later to reach out.
I think it's probably better for yourself as well in terms of keeping well and yeah.
There's camaraderie in teaching.
We're not doing it alone.
We need to lean on each other.
It is a tough job at times.
There's times where we're using a lot of our own energy to try and keep the dynamic of
the classroom up and leaning on each other and knowing that, yes, I'm not alone.
And again, explaining to the new staff, you know, if I have a class period five on a Friday
afternoon and it's a free dress day and it's windy outside. Even after 15 years of teaching,
I can guarantee I probably want to throw my lesson plan out the window.
It's just knowing that that's not a reflection on me as a person or a teacher even. It's just
the dynamics of that moment in time. And so we learned from what happens and maybe next time
when I go in and period five on a Friday and I have a plan in place that's going to be a bit
more flexible, a bit more dynamic for those kids. And you know if we go back to relationships,
what stops a teacher saying to the students, "This is the routine, we all know it, we're going to do
presentations next, but let's throw it out the window." Why? I'm feeling a bit tired, how are
you all feeling? It's that confidence for a teacher, that self-efficacy, to say, "Something's not
working, I don't have a mentor at hand, I'm going to ask the students and if you've built a rapport
in a relationship. It's amazing how much good will they have to let you know how to manage
them. So sometimes we forget to tell teachers that, you know, camaraderie, mentors, colleagues,
the students themselves.
Oh, it's a partnership, isn't it?
Exactly.
Absolutely.
And the great tool in a classroom, particularly if you're having a lesson that's not going
exactly to plan, is class discussion. Never underestimate a class discussion. Admittedly,
my first class at my new school that I started this term, the lesson got away from me. I
I had too much class discussion, so I'm sort of chasing my tail in terms of a timeline,
but it's been so worth it because I get to know the kids and we get to know the material
whilst doing that. It's great.
Do you know, I always say connection over content. You've got it, Callum, because the
content will come and it will accelerate if the connection is there.
It's that go slow to go fast type idea that, you know, if you build the relationships and
then get into the content that actually you'll speed up in the end because you'll have the
kids with you. You'll know where they are, they'll know where you are. And then you work
through which is where your routine comes in too.
And as Maria had already pointed out, the routine isn't just made by the teacher. It
is something that's actually in best practice developed as a whole class. So we're all partners
in learning in that classroom. And so what kind of routine would you like to have in
place? What makes you feel safe? We do pivot surveys at school so the students are giving
us feedback on a regular basis on our teaching practice.
And I know one of my areas of conversation was that I needed more routine in my classroom.
And I as a person with what I felt like very strict routine, I was like, oh, really, I'm
not doing enough routine.
So I went back to the students and said, hey, listen, you said that I didn't have enough
routine in the classroom.
We had a conversation about it and it was that I wasn't making it explicit that it was routine.
And they were like, "Oh yeah, you do do that."
And I was like, "Oh, there we go."
So that conversation was a moment for all of us.
For me to realize I needed to be more explicit
about what I was doing and share in that kind of teaching
experience with the students that were there.
And for them, I could kind of get their perspective
a little bit more.
But we did then come up with a plan
about what a routine for them would look like
and include them in that conversation.
And then funnily enough, you know, what's the top of my next pivot survey?
Oh, routine.
So, you know,
that's it.
And that's what I love about the primaries.
We've got so much to learn from our colleagues.
They've got the vault and the will up on the board.
What's the vault?
We are learning to, and then the will fears.
What does that look like?
What am I looking for?
And then at the end, they look at the intention and say, did we get there?
And I love that.
It's that making that learning visible and your routine visible.
But as secondary, sometimes we're siloed.
Whereas, you know, I think primaries have a lot more tools around that sort of,
you know, structure.
Those learning intentions and success criteria.
And a lot of us were putting them in our lesson plan on compass.
So it's visible to the students from the morning of that day.
Um, and then it's in the PowerPoint.
And then actually we went back to the students and said, how is that going?
and they said, we just want you to write it on the board.
There you go.
And I was like, oh, and it was because they weren't having
immediate access to the PowerPoint.
It wasn't staying in their eye sight, eye line.
So, you know, suddenly we're putting it up on the whiteboard.
That's what we wanted.
We wanted visible learning.
We wanted to see what our learning intention
and success criteria was.
Small tweak, but made a huge difference to those students.
not coming back to the success criteria
at the end of the lesson.
Because I find when I do and I spend the last five minutes of period,
let's go through this, did we do these?
Can we tick these off?
Then the students retain a bit more and they discuss it and they go,
"Oh yeah, we get this now."
Whereas I find if I don't come back to it and we don't discuss it at the end,
then the lesson finishes and then I'll try and let's recap in the next lesson.
Oh, I don't remember.
And invariably my next sort of sentence to them is,
Let's open up our books from last lesson and see what we did.
OK, it's time for a small break, but please don't go anywhere
because coming up our guests are going to explore some strategies for
building relationships with students, including some clever classroom activities
to foster connections and improve learning outcomes.
If this has sparked your interest in developing your teaching practice further,
head over to our website to discover our range of postgraduate and short course study options,
including our short courses on engaging in positive support practice
and understanding and managing challenging behaviour.
Visit monash.edu/education/learnmore
for more information about how to enroll in any of these programs.
Now let's get back to the show.
What I'm also hearing is there's a bit of a link between the ideas around the managing
and actually the quality learning.
Absolutely.
If you don't have that situation, that classroom environment in the prime,
you aren't going to have the students ready for that learning. They have to be in that position.
So actually the managing, the relationship building and that isn't sacrificing the learning of...
No, no. Connection over content. Not at all.
But is it more connection to support content?
Absolutely. It's connection to make breakthroughs and to facilitate and to enrich content.
And it's what Sky was saying, you know, with the emotional intelligence stuff and Callum's
experiences, you know, in terms of special schools and how important a relationship is there.
Incredibly important because a lot of the children don't have the language in which to
express things. And sometimes it's just you having that relationship and knowing that there's
something's going to escalate. You can see it, the fidgeting, the this, the that. And so it's,
you know, pre-emptive in terms of the managing of behavior. But my question to both of you is,
and a lot of pre-service teachers ask me, and I've got ideas here, but you know, how do you get
relationships? You can't walk into a classroom and say, "I'm Maria and I'm married and I'm,
they want to know who you are." They're very, very, you know, and we tell students, pre-service
teachers, "Watch your settings on all your social media because they are so curious about who you are."
they will find everything, even your Instagram. And so how do you build those relationships
without being explicit and having kids go, "Ugh," because they do want to know who you are,
but how do you go about? I think if you've done it really well, it is about being able to be open
to sharing ourselves. Yeah. Because if we ourselves aren't being vulnerable and willing to share that
personal side, the students won't feel like they can open up to us. And so it might be the incident
conversation that you say, "Oh, on the weekend I did this with my children."
"Oh, you have children, Miss?" "Yeah, yeah, I've got X, Y and Z children."
And they get to know you as a person. I'm sure they all think we sleep under our
desks and we live at school all the time and they see you at the supermarket and
they go, "Oh, hello." But it is sharing those things. But also, I think there are
are some value, my drama teacher as I've pointed out,
value in using actual tools to get to know them.
So maybe a game like Two Truths and a Lie
is a really nice way to just,
I spray can get to know people
and you find out stuff about your students
and they find out stuff about themselves.
who can hear us and Rebecca is our amazing leader here.
there is a whole team around us with lighting and everything.
And I'm gonna rustle paper,
which might get the audio person a little bit nervous,
but I've got like a brown paper bag.
And you've gotta think that a graduate teacher
in a secondary school could have up to six classes a week.
We're talking 125 children.
And when I say relationships,
it's exactly what Callum said.
They go out there and they go rose-colored glasses.
they come back after placement in second year and say,
are you for real?
How are you gonna get to know 100?
How did they get to know you?
So there are activities and this one is year seven C.
So at the beginning of a class,
you ask them to get out a piece of paper
and ask you any question about yourself
that they would like to ask you if they met you.
And so they say, any question, don't get nervous
because in all my years of teaching,
I didn't get any really bad ones,
But at the end of it, somehow they don't realize
you read the questions.
So I've got paper bags that have year seven C.
Now I do it with pre-service and I say, who am I?
See, I'm rustling.
Who am I?
And I give them a strip of paper,
they don't write their name on it
and they ask me a question.
Now you look at a group of year 10
and you think they're gonna ask a really naughty question.
And the question is, how old were you
when you had your first kiss?
Or what's your favorite movie?
So when you read all the questions,
you realise that they might look like adults
if you've got an older class,
but they really are children at heart.
As an English teacher, I also look at all the language.
And I think, I've got a big job with this class.
The spelling is awful.
And this one, isn't this interesting?
I will, I was gonna put it away, but I won't.
I just pulled it out.
And a pre-service teacher asked me
after a class on exactly this topic,
have you ever punched anyone?
(laughing)
So now I want to know the answer.
Thanks, you have a great question.
But what you're doing in classroom management
is you've got this paper bag and you walk in
and they all can't wait for their question to come out.
So you push it out for the whole term.
And so I'll pull it out and I'll go,
have I punched anyone?
Not really.
Are you talking about in my imagination?
Or are you talking about for real?
(laughing)
And then you say, of course not,
because you go to duty of care,
you go to professional responsibilities.
And if you really think about punching a child,
please leave the profession now.
But these sort of activities allow you every so often.
And the minute you show the paper bag, they're all quiet.
'Cause it's like a social media moment.
You know, she's going to unveil something about herself.
And then what you do is you go home
and you take out any cheeky ones.
Like how many times a week do you,
and you think, oh, I wonder who that was.
So you rip it up and as you take them out,
they forget how many you've taken out.
'cause I ripped them up.
So you get to one and you go,
how many times a week do I,
and the child who's written it gets very excited
so you know who it was.
And you say, watch television.
Well, I don't because I correct your work.
(laughing)
So there are so many activities
that can allow you to connect, right?
But it's being, you both said it,
it's being open, it's being open to changing,
to being flexible, and to be a learner.
We don't know it all.
I'm sure there are better activities than that one.
And if I was out there in schools, I'd be curious,
what is Sky using?
What's Talon using?
I might use that.
of when I've been able to do that
and use the classroom activities
to get to know the students.
One is more so for the younger levels
as an English teacher,
I would start the year by writing a letter to the students,
telling them about who I am,
some key bits of information,
and then their task for the lesson
would be to read my letter
and then respond with some information about them.
So it's twofold. I get to know who they are, get some good bits of information that I can, you know, use to
to build that relationship. And I also get to see what their writing's like.
Oh, literacy scan.
I love it.
Another one is when I teach history and I go through chronology and timelines and we do the I do, we do, you do.
And I'll do a timeline on the board of my life and share things about where I've been, where I've lived and the type of
experience that I have in the hope that they will then reciprocate and share back.
Just little things like that that can be almost subconscious.
I spoke to my principal earlier this week about it, about a class
exactly like that, doing a timeline.
He says, I'm not sure if you meant to do it like that.
And I said, admittedly, it was sort of my intention to share with the class,
but not so explicitly.
And he goes, it was a real eye opener to get to know more about you.
Perfect.
If he saw it, then the kids definitely did.
So little things like that.
Absolutely.
I know how much that letter would mean to your students too, because my own daughter
who's just started Foundation has the letter of her own Foundation teacher posted up next
to her bed.
And she comes home and she tells me, you know, my teacher's favorite color is green.
Do you know she was a twin?
And she comes home with these anecdotes of the teacher's life or the things about her.
And I know every time she tells me one of those, how important that is to her in connecting
with that teacher.
More connection, more trust.
She's more likely to excel in her learning with somebody that she feels that connected
to.
Such powerful stuff is so simple.
So we're almost at the end of our time, would you believe?
I know.
Goodness.
I know.
We can keep talking forever.
Absolutely could.
I'd like to leave with all of you sharing with us the one great piece of advice you
were given that has really influenced you and stuck with you throughout your career
and any of you are welcome to jump in when you're ready.
This is something that I tell the students as well and it is just ask the questions.
Just keep asking.
One more question is never going to hurt.
And so I would tell my students myself, just send me an email, ask me questions.
I'd rather you ask me a million questions
and me sort of have to deal with them
than you feel like you're not sure what to do.
And I think that's the same for me as a teacher.
If I don't know something, I'm gonna find out.
I'm gonna ask questions.
That's it.
And for graduate teachers, ask for help.
Just ask.
and very open and reassuring for your students too.
'cause young students are often a bit nervous to ask,
but we're very lucky we've got all this technology now
that they can do it behind a screen, they can still ask.
But it's sharing that sometimes, you know,
we get a bit nervous and we get a bit confused as well
and it's okay.
is really important.
And I think also modeling for our students
what that looks like.
So I was talking about how we receive that feedback
and then share it back with our students.
We are actually modeling how to receive feedback
and how to action some feedback as well.
So we can't assume that they know how to use it.
I guess my piece would be that I would always try and assume positive intent.
That's both for my, with my colleagues and also with my students.
As I said earlier, I don't think misbehaviour is students with any kind of
ill intent. I actually think that it's usually a communication about something
else. And we really just need to find out a little bit more to help understand
somebody else's perspective. So.
Ask one more question.
I think mine was really interesting.
I started off teaching trying to be sedate and trying to have the teacher voice until
somebody who I really respected as a teacher said, "You look very troubled and you don't
look comfortable.
Be yourself.
Take into your teaching a part of your identity.
So if you are excitable, show that."
There isn't a sort of a pro forma or a template as to what a teacher should be or shouldn't
be.
is the uniqueness of all of us, you know,
and how our students get that.
But I have become mindful and I've said things like,
if I speak too quickly and I walk around the room so much,
that could actually make some students quite nervous.
It's performative in a way.
And so I've become very mindful about the connection
and saying, this is how sometimes I teach
and if I go too fast, give me a sign.
And as soon as I see it, I'll be able to adapt.
So it's what you said about modelling.
It's what Callum said about connecting and questions,
you know, and I think that was the best piece of advice I got.
I stopped trying to be somebody I wasn't in the classroom.
And they pick it up.
They know when you're authentic and they know when you're not.
So I learnt that the hard way.
and for bringing your wealth of wisdom and insight
to the podcast for us today.
Thank you so much.
Thank you for having us. - Thanks for having us.
Thank you for having us, Rebecca.
I hope you've taken some notes,
but if you've missed anything, it's all in the show notes.
Join us for our upcoming episode,
where we delve into the subject of coaching and mentoring
and explore how these practices can greatly influence
the professional growth and development of teachers
at all stages of their career.
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